Transcript of Trends in Electronic Student Services
Slide: WCET Presents a Webcast Series: Providing
Student Services to Distance Learners
PAT: Hello, and welcome to
the WCET webcast series, providing student services to distance
learners. I am Pat Shea, the Assistant Director for WCET. And I'm
coming to you today from our east coast office in Summit, New Jersey.
Also joining us from WCET's headquarters in Boulder, Colorado, is
my colleague Sue Armitage. Welcome, Sue.
SUE: Hello, Pat, and everyone
in the audience. Our host, HorizonLive, would like to know if you
in the audience have participated in a HorizonLive session before.
Please look at your screens and find the green "yes" and
the red "no" button. Please go ahead now and click on
the appropriate button to indicate whether you are a HorizonLive
veteran or not.
PAT: And those buttons are
in the black bar, right underneath the screen.
SUE: Yes, above your picture,
Pat.
PAT: Right. So, it looks like
we have a number of people who've been here before, but a number
who have not experienced this. So we’ll try to give you some tips
as we're moving through the beginning here, so you are comfortable
with this new environment.
Slide: Trends in Electronic Student Services
With Darlene Burnett
PAT: Our special guest today
is Darlene Burnett, a consultant in higher education to IBM, where
she heads up its best practice partners in student services initiative.
Darlene will be talking with us today about trends in electronic
student services. Welcome, Darlene, and how is it there in Cary,
North Carolina?
DARLENE: Thank you, Pat, and
hello. It's a beautiful day. I was just chatting with some of the
folks in our message box that we're having a beautiful fall day.
I'm delighted to be here and what I'd like to do is start by asking
our attendees to get acquainted and start using the chat box. I've
been chatting with several of the folks and I notice that we still
have a lot that are talking. But I'd like for you just to indicate,
if you haven't already, which institution or organization you're
with.
SUE: And where you're located.
DARLENE: And where you're
located. Thank you, Sue.
SUE: Well, I've been looking
at the list so far and we have people from all over. Alaska, Utah,
Idaho, North Carolina, Houston, Arizona, Vermont, California, North
Dakota, Ohio and Chicago. So welcome, everybody. We're awfully glad
that you're here.
DARLENE: Well, it looks like
we have about forty-four folks that responded yes and no to the
question. And I'd like to just encourage you to keep using the chat
box as we're doing the presentation. So if there's information that
comes up that you'd like to discuss, or just from your experiences
that you'd like to share with the other listeners on the session.
PAT: Okay, that's great. And
if you experience connectivity problems during this presentation,
please call HorizonLive, and let me give you a number that you can
jot down so that you'll have it. That number is 877-825-5810. Again,
the number is 877-825-5810. Or you can click on the help button
to send an email message to tech support.
SUE: And there are a lot of
people online today, and if you'd like to send a private message
to one of the people online, you're welcome to do so. You see in
the block bar there's a “Tell” icon. Click on “Tell,” write a message,
and only the person that you select will be able to see your message.
Question: Are you primarily interested in
service for students located off-campus, on campus, or a combination
of both?
PAT: Okay, so to get a better
sense of your interest today, we'd like to put a question up in
the dialogue box, going to have you respond to it. And it's, “Are
you primarily interested in services for students located off-campus,
on campus or a combination of the two?” So if you'll respond to
that question on your screen. I'll give you just a second or so.
And while you're responding to that, I want to tell you that this
webcast, Trends in Electronic Student Services is the second in
our series on providing student services to distance learners. This
series is brought to you by WCET in partnership with HorizonLive
and I understand Brendan, who's on here providing some technical
support, that HorizonLive was named best of the breed this week
by US News and World Report. So congratulations. Each month through
June, except for December, we will have a webcast on a different
student service. So we'll hope that you'll join us on some of those
future webcasts as well. Okay, Susan, do you have some results here
that you can tell us about?
SUE: This is interesting technology.
I'm sorry it took me a little time because I'm working through it
— I'm sorry.
DARLENE: Well, we have fifty-two
"yes" responses and one "no" response. I'm wondering
if folks used the "yes/no" button.
PAT: It's possible. I see
the box at the top of the screen there in the magenta area, if you
would enter your response to that question. Ah, there you go.
Question Results
SUE: There we go. So everybody
can look at the responses, as we look at the question. Off-campus,
on campus or combination. So it looks like it's off-campus or a
combination as the primary area of interest.
DARLENE: Okay. That's good
to know. We'll I'll make sure that I move my remarks or make sure
my remarks cover those areas.
Slide: WCET, the Cooperative advancing the
effective use of technology in higher education.
PAT: Okay, and for those of
you who are not familiar with WCET, it's a cooperative of higher
education institutions, agencies, non-profit organizations involved
in distance learning. Our focus is on advancing the effective use
of technology in higher education. And you'll see on the screen
some more information about WCET and also the website address where
you can find even more information. I will call your attention to
the fact that we do have an annual conference coming up called eRevolution
and EDU, which will be held in Coeur d'Alene, Idaho. It starts on
Halloween and goes through November 3rd, and there will be a number
of student services presentations there.
Slide: Trends in Electronic Student Services
“Best Practices”
PAT: So now, it's time to
properly introduce our guest Darlene Burnett. Darlene began researching
best practice models about seven years ago in her work with IBM.
Prior to joining IBM, Darlene worked at Pittsburgh State University
at the University of Kansas, and at Johnson County Community College.
Darlene received a BS in Business Administration with majors in
Computer Information Systems and Accounting from Pittsburgh State
University, and an MBA in Organizational Behavior from the University
of Missouri. She has written widely on the topic of best practices
in student services. Okay. And now Darlene.
Slide: From Transactions to Relationships
DARLENE: Thank you very much.
I'm delighted to be with you today and, again, just keep those questions
coming in if there's something you'd like for me to talk about.
I'd like to start today on this first slide by discussing an over-arching
trend that we've begun to identify. There's a book by Joseph Pine
and James Gilmore called The Experience Economy. And in that book
they start to focus on how in delivering services to students or
to consumers in general we're starting to move away from a focus
on transactions and we're moving to a focus on relationships. And
in doing that, the shift is really from a service economy that is
transactional to an experience economy that's relational.
Slide: What is a “Best Practice” in Student
Services?
DARLENE: So as we look at
the services in a one-stop center, and I talk about added value
or we talk about services in Web portals and Web services in a fourth
generation, I'm really starting to talk about that experience level.
On this chart, I'm starting to identify now some of the focus areas
for best practices and student services. There's twenty-three institutions
that have been identified by IBM as having models of best practices
in student services. Some are one-stop centers, some use technology.
But the key is that each of them has contributed some of the unique
innovations. And out of those models, what we have identified is
that the trend that runs through there, the best practice model,
there is a focus on the customer or student satisfaction and success.
When I say "customer" I know that that's not a comfortable
term or a common term that's used with the university or a college,
but the twenty-three institutions have all made that switch and
they truly view the service portion interaction with their students
and they view them as a customer. And in doing so, they have changed
how they view that interaction. And instead of viewing that interaction
from the institutional view, they have inverted it and they view
it from the student view, and they have redesigned their processes
as such. And added value is a core word, and this added value is
what creates the relationship around the transaction.
When you are in a face-to-face environment delivering service,
the student wants the person to be able to answer the question the
first time correctly and they want them to be able to answer a range
of questions. The last one is choice. The students want the ability
to choose a time, place and service context.
Slide: What is a “Best Practice” in Student
Services? Self Service, Empowered front line staff, Cross-functional
teams, Institutional strategy, Executive commitment
DARLENE: As we look at the
additional focus areas for best practice in student area services,
we come to three choices: self-service, generalist and specialist.
And the students, when they choose, 70% of the time will choose
self-service. And this is your on-campus student; 20% will choose
generalist and 10% will choose or need specialist.
Slide: Old Process New Process
DARLENE: And when I say generalist,
I don't mean the generalist in terms of general knowledge, but the
person has a breadth of knowledge, a wide range of knowledge. Some
institutions are using that as an area to promote specialist because
of the training and the wide range of knowledge that's required.
Slide: What is a “Best Practice” in Student
Services? Self Service, Empowered front line staff, Cross-functional
teams, institutional strategy, Executive commitment
DARLENE: The chart you were
just seeing on your screen, the inverted pyramid, demonstrated the
old service model and how we're moving to the new service model,
where the majority of interactions were from the specialist, and
now the majority of interactions will be with auto-transactions
and self-service. In addition, the two key focus areas that are
a requirement to be a successful best practice — and by that
I mean that it’s for you to be able to sustain the project and have
the support, it really needs to be a key part of the institutional
strategy and it also needs to have your executive cabinet the support
and commitment. That seems to be a differentiator and between a
successful project and one that never quite reaches success. I'd
like to ask a question now and I'd like for you to answer a question.
I'd like to know if your institution has a physical one-stop center,
and, if so, is it part of your institutional strategy for service?
And if you just type in your chat box, that would be great
Slide: Institutions Recognize the Need to
Change
DARLENE: And while we're getting
those responses back, whether you have a physical one-stop center,
I'd like to take a look at the next slide, which discusses the traditional
model for student services. In the traditional model for student
services, the one that we certainly all grew up in when we went
to college, the student is moved from physical building to physical
building. And within those physical buildings, there's three streams
of services that I've depicted: enrolment services, academic support
services, and student support services. And in those streams of
services, we have offices and individuals, so you can start to see
just pictorially the number of individuals and the number of places
that we physically move our students to.
Now, this is one of those parallels that I want you to make the
jump from physical one-stop center to electronic services. What
I've noticed is that the majority of institutions, when they start
delivering electronic student services over the Web, they replicate
the physical model. They replicate the physical silos, they replicate
the physical offices, and we move the students virtually around
the website the same way that we have been moving them around the
physical center. And, of course, we have a history and a tradition
of why we do it on campus, but we don't have those restrictions
or barriers on the Web.
So keep that in mind, it’s one of the over-arching principles
of relationship, in addition to transaction, that the Web doesn't
have those restrictions.
Well, it looks like we have a lot of the responses in and I would
say that, by and large, it looks like the majority do not have physical
one-stop centers.
SUE: I would agree, just looking
at it. And we've got a nice number of yeses, but I think the majority
is no.
PAT: Let me ask you this Darlene.
A number of campuses, though, have created one-stop centers, and
then go on to create a center on the Web. Is it possible for institutions
to skip the phase of creating the physical one-stop center and just
move directly into creating a virtual one-stop center on their website?
DARLENE: Absolutely. Even
if you look at the list of the Twenty-three Best Practice Institutions
some of them started with the physical one-stop centers, and some
of them started with the Web portals and the Web services. What’s
interesting to note, and what you might not have expected and one
that I didn’t expect, was that those institutions that started with
the physical one-stop centers, it was a natural transition to flow
into Web portals and Web services. University of Delaware, Boston
College, two examples that started ten years ago. But what I hadn’t
anticipated was the University of Minnesota was really one of our
first Web portals and did an outstanding job, beginning about six
years ago. They have, in the last year, been looking at creating
physical one-stop centers. So you can start in either place, but
then it seems that the traditional students’ demand will require
that you have both. So even if you’re focusing on electronic student
services, if you need in-person interaction, at some point you’ll
need to consider it.
PAT: I see. Good to know.
Slide: What are the Trends?
DARLENE: Well, let’s take
a look at some of the trends. There’s about six trends that I’d
like to focus on. The first three focuses on culture. And this is
another one of those key areas that you need to consider when you’re
implementing or initiating a project. And that’s the culture shift.
One of the most difficult things about this type of project, when
you’re trying to create a student-centered service environment,
is that you need to change the view from the internal view to the
external view. From what the institution needs to what the student
needs. And that 180 degree shift, that filter or vision, every question
you ask about the service should be from that context. What does
the student need? How would we interact with the student? The second
trend is the interaction, and we’ve spoken about that briefly, in
making sure that you’re moving from just a focus on transactions
to creating a very positive experience and building that relationship.
It also needs to be strategic.
If we look at the last three trends, there’s a shift from individual
departments to institution Web-wide portals. When you’re working
with students, and their interaction with the institution is on
the Web, and they’re doing all electronic services, it becomes extremely
important that there is a Web-portal strategy for the institution
so that every Web page they click on has the same look and feel,
has the same navigation, has the same branding. That becomes absolutely
critical when that’s their primary interaction with the institution.
And the branding most institutions have a focus on the print material.
They have criteria. They have reviews. But we don’t have those things
in place for the Web. I mean, we kind of started up bootstrap on
the Web operations, and so those things haven’t been put in place
yet. But you really need to consider that for the level of focus
that you all have with electronic student services.
And the last is the service delivery. We’re no longer just focusing,
you know, on the job change, but we’re really focusing on how do
we sustain these changes once we have a different way about doing
this?
Question: Are your institution’s student
service initiatives part of a institution-wide strategic plan or
departmental?
DARLENE: Well, at this point
I’d like to hear from you about your student-service initiatives.
Are they part of the strategic plan for your institution, or are
they departmental? And if you would pick the radio button on your
screen and vote, that would be great. I don’t think this discussion
will be on CD, but you can go in on the archive and look at this
information.
PAT: Yes, we’ll have it accessible
from our website for about one year from today.
SUE: Well, it’ll probably
take a couple of days to be archived and made available, but we’ll
be up there for a long time.
DARLENE: And there’s a question
of ROI information on your technical investment. Louisiana State
University has done an outstanding job with their Web portal and
doing an ROI study on the results. And they’ve done that study in
terms of how much more service they’re able to deliver for the same
cost. And so that you may want to look or talk with someone there.
And also WCET has some information on technology, the Technology
Methodology Project looks at some of the Return On Investment, I
think. So that’s another source of information.
DARLENE: Well it looks like
most people have indicated for me to go ahead and publish the results.
Question Results:
Are your institution’s student service initiatives part of a institution-wide
strategic plan or departmental?
DARLENE: It’s very close between
institutional strategic plan and departmental. Reactions are going
on on both sides.
PAT: I think that’s very interesting.
I think, sometimes, when you can begin at the institutional-wide,
strategic level, that’s great. But sometimes you have to start at
the departmental level and prove that it can be successful as a
pilot before you can move on to an institution-wide, strategic plan.
Have you found that to be the case, Darlene?
DARLENE: I have. And in some
cases, Pat, when you don’t yet have the executive cabinet support,
sometimes it’s very important to create a departmental model and
departmental prototype and then use that as a basis for gaining
the institution-wide support and the executive cabinet support to
make it strategic.
PAT: Okay.
Slide: Parallels and Lessons to be Learned
DARLENE: Okay. Well, let’s
take a look now, Pat, at some of the parallels and lessons to be
learned. One of the things that I wanted to do was to share the
experience of those that have been doing one-stop physical centers
for ten years, some of the knowledge and experience they’ve gained,
and the path that they’ve taken. Those individuals and institutions
have really focused on the redesigned processes. And as they’ve
moved into delivery of electronic student services, what they found
is that those same philosophies apply to the electronic student
services. That it’s very critical to redesign the processes electronically
for the virtual center as it is for the physical. And one really
key area that they’ve learned is — and they have moved, and
provided choice for their students, and 70% have elected to do Web
or self-service — what that means now for those centers is
that they’ve had to create email and phone support centers. The
generalists that are usually on the front counter are now staffing
the phone, and are also staffing the email so that those students
who are asking those questions, electronically, are getting the
same level of excellence and the same level of information. In addition,
they are focusing, and have identified that they need to find ways
of creating the positive experience on the Web that they’ve managed
to create in that physical environment.
PAT: Darlene, when you talk
about redesigning student processes here, that takes a lot of time
to do that. I think for many institutions it’s easier for them to,
sort of, Web-enize current services than it is to really focus on
redesigning services. And I think to do that successfully, you really
have to involve cross-functional teams. Has that been your experience?
DARLENE: Well, you do, because
you really want an individual from each of the service areas represented
to help define that holistic view that the student needs and wants.
But I’ll also tell you that if you just Web-enize your traditional
manner of delivering services, it becomes very apparent when the
student compares that interaction on the Web with the interaction
of another institution that has done redesign. And then if you want
to get to the fourth generation of Web services, it really becomes
important to think and redesign how those services are delivered.
I’d like to pose another question to you.
Question: What services do you currently
have online?
DARLENE: What services do
you currently have online? I’m sure that you have a lot of functionality
already. I’ve gone on a lot of these websites, or your websites,
and seen what you have out there. But I think it would be helpful
to just get an idea from each of you what you think are the key
services, perhaps, that you have online.
PAT: We’ll give folks just
a minute or so to answer.
DARLENE: While answering that
question I’d like to provide a little information on where I see
the Web services heading. There was a report by Gartner Group last
year, and in that report they indicated that about 5% of colleges
and universities had Web portals. And they also, based on their
research, indicated that they believe that in four more years, 2005,
80% of the colleges and universities would have Web portals. Now,
what that says to me is that in 2000 and 2001, if you have a Web
portal, that’s a differentiator and it gives you a competitive advantage
and that it is consistent with some of the really great consumer
sites that your students are used to using. But what that also means,
that in four more years, that’s business as usual. So you need to
figure out how to go beyond Web portal and transactions, and how
to begin incorporating or leapfrog, and add all of the relationship
and experience elements into delivery of electronic student services.
PAT: How are we doing on the
responses, Sue?
SUE: Not a whole lot of people
responded but we can go ahead and look what they have to say. Information
only, information, that’s registration, orientation library. Barbara
Beringer says, “All service is excellent.”
PAT: So it looks like what
we have here is what WCET has found earlier is that a lot of the
administrative core kinds of services are the first services that
are up on the Web. And then the other services like academic advising,
counseling, orientations tend to follow. Okay.
DARLENE: Well, that looks
like we’ve got some transactional information out there. There’s
quite a bit of functionality.
Question Results: What services do you
currently have online?
DARLENE: It looks like it’s
probably starting with enrollment management courses which is pretty
consistent. Well, I’d like to now switch to the electronic student
services focus, specifically, and talk about what I’ve learned,
or how I see the evolution is moving through the four generations.
Slide: The Evolution of Web Services Covers
Four Distinct Generations
DARLENE: And this first generation
is what I consider the replication of the physical, traditional
environment. The focus is on content, it’s internal view of the
institution. It’s internal vocabulary. The one word that I pull
out that I think really helps define this, is the word, “bursar.”
The word, “bursar” isn’t an everyday word that a student would use.
And they have to learn what that means when they interact with an
institution. So we use those different words in the vocabulary,
not only in speaking with the student, but also what we’ve put on
the Web. So let’s move to our first example. The first generation
Web portal.
Slide: Generation 1 Displays Content in an
Easy to Find Manner
DARLENE: This is an actual
home page of an institution. I’ve taken the name of the institution
off so that it won’t be apparent. But what you’ll see when you look
at this front page, their home page, is that everything is divided
into silos. It’s all internal language. It’s internal view. And
it replicates the traditional, physical environment. And it’s all
perfectly good information, but the student is used to interacting
with consumer sites that really focus on experience.
Slide: The Evolution of Web Services Covers
Four Distinct Generations — Generation 2 highlighted
DARLENE: So let’s take a look
at generation two and see how the service has evolved. And I’ll
show you some examples of that. In generation two, we move from
just content to putting the content within context. And so in the
context area we might have prospective students.
Slide: Generation 2 Displays Information
by Customer and Content
DARLENE: And let’s take a
look at an example of a generation two, and I’ve selected the University
of Delaware. This is their homepage. So the first thing a student
or parent would see when they go to University of Delaware, this
is their homepage. And on the right, it has the context. Prospective
students, current students, parents and alumni. So if I were to
select prospective students, it would have all of the content for
prospective students in one place for me. And so now we’re starting
to, at least, filter all of that information and help the user get
what they need. If we look at the next slide.
Slide: Generation 2 Displays Information
by Customer and Content — Student Central
PAT: A sort of a group of
paths through the website.
DARLENE: It is. We're looking
at a looking group level. We're looking at the generic student.
And another example is the University of Texas at Austin, and this
happens to be their current student. So they have collected the
information that a current student would need, but you probably
can't read the small print, but what I'd like for you to think about
or talk about on this one is that under admissions, it's “Apply
for admissions,” “Check your status,” “Find an in-state transfer,”
“Class registration,” “To see the registration,” “Register for a
class,” and, “Paying a fee receipt,” “View my class schedule,” you'll
notice that this is switched to all action words. We're telling
the student what they need to do. We're stating to put a focus on
profit and that's very different than just having the words and
the content there.
PAT: So you can see the beginnings
of a relationship starting to form.
DARLENE: Exactly. We’re adding
value now to this information. We're helping guide the student just
a bit. Okay, well, let's look at generation three.
Slide: The Evolution of Web Services Covers
Four Distinct Generations — Generation 3 highlighted
DARLENE: Now generation three
is what I consider the true portal. It has personalization, customization
and community. It still focuses on transactions, but it has those
elements. At generation two it's a collection of students and in
generation three, it's me as an individual: it's my information.
So let's look at an example of personalized and customized.
Slide: Generation 3 Displays Information
that is Customized and Personalized and Creates a One-Stop Virtual
Center
PAT: Now, Darlene, when you
say personalized and customized, by personalized you mean for me,
the individual, it's a message directly to me, with my information,
and by customized you mean I can put whatever information I want
on that particular Web page?
DARLENE: That's exactly what
it means. It's my grades, my financial information, my personal
address and personal information. And the customization is that
I get to choose what items are going to be on the screen and I'll
show you an example of that in a minute. What we're looking at now
is the University of Minnesota. And there's a couple of points I
wanted to make on this website. The first was about branding. You'll
notice that they have the ticket, the one-stop "M" ticket?
That's their branding. The University of Minnesota has created a
set of criterion standards, and if anyone wants to include their
services in the virtual one-stop center, they have to meet the standards
and criteria and then they get to use that one-stop ticket on their
page. Now, if you're looking at that and you see student, faculty
and staff, and that was all that we saw, that's generation two,
because that's a collection of generic individuals and it's just
general content. But when we go to my one-stop, that's my personal
information and that's what we would have on the student page.
Slide: Customized and Personalized One-Stop
Virtual Center
DARLENE: Let's take a look
at the University of Texas Austin again. The University of Texas
Austin, this is the home page. This is my one-stop. This is my Web
portal. And what I want to bring you attention to here is the consistency
of branding, the consistency, the look and feel, navigation on the
left, so they have a consistent navigation. They have the left column
that has the different information that you might need. But under
campus information, that's where you get to customize what you want
on your website. And under the Texas Daily, you get to choose what
you want to see there. But the navigation is consistent from page
to page. The look and feel is consistent from page to page, and
it's my personal information. And they also will push or publish
information to me based on my individual set of needs.
PAT: This would be a good
time, Darlene, to pose a question from the chat box. There's a concern
over the security and privacy of information that people post or
include in their own page.
DARLENE: Yes.
PAT: Do you have any concerns
about privacy and security of personal information?
DARLENE: Well, privacy is
a critical issue on all of the campuses and for those institutions
that have implemented the virtual one-stop centers, they've had
to deal with the authentication, one log-on, one ID, and how they
would validate that the individual does have access to that. So,
they've all addressed that and I haven't heard of any of them, other
than just the one or two cases where someone has left a screen up
or someone has printed out a page with their password on it. But
I haven't really heard of any problems with security of the personal
information.
PAT: And it looks like Chris
Brooker says, “By utilizing a secure authentication, they've managed
to provide more security.”
DARLENE: Excellent.
PAT: So it looks like some
of the folks on the website are sharing information about how they've
handled that problem also.
DARLENE: Well, Pat, let's
take a look at the next slide, LSU.
Slide: LSU PAWS — Customized and Personalized
One-Stop Virtual Center — Community
PAT: Now, is that Louisiana
State University?
DARLENE: It is. Louisiana
State University and they have a one-stop portal also. And again,
my definition of portal, it's personalized, customized, has community
and has a large range of transactions. On the left is “My Desktop,”
and it's too small for you to read the detail, but it has all of
the functions that I might want to perform, so I could locate people,
publish information, course information. But this is an example
of their chat or their discussion or their community. And it's a
great example of how you can start to help use the technology to
create relationships.
Slide: The Evolution of Web Services Covers
Four Distinct Generations — Generation 4 highlighted
DARLENE: Okay, let's take
a look at generation four. Generation four is where all of you will
want to go with the delivery of your electronic student services.
If 2004 is the target when 80% of your peers will have Web portals,
you need to be thinking now about how you design into those Web
services and portals that high touch, high tech relationship and
experience. So let's look at our first example.
PAT: Darlene, is this where
you start to see some artificial intelligence involved in these
sites?
Slide: Generation 4 Creates High Touch/High
Tech
DARLENE: Well, it is, Pat.
At this point, when you start to get the high touch, high tech,
it probably is the best example that everyone would know about would
be Amazon.com. I’m sure many of the folks online have used Amazon.com
and you've bought a book, you've bought a CD, and Amazon.com will
you know, talk about data mining or artificial intelligence, they
will mine that information about you so that the next time you come
online, they'll present you with other CDs by the same artist or
other CDs in the same genre or same genre of books or the same author.
So you start to learn about the individual's preferences, interests
and then you present information to them.
So the commercial sites and models have some excellent examples
that we might think about picking up and using for education. And
you have on the screen now the criteria for the fourth generation.
It goes back to what we learned about, the one-stop centers, it
has process orientation: we're guiding the students through it.
It's a holistic view. We create decision-making guides. We're presenting
personalized recommendations for their enrollment schedule. We're
presenting personalized recommendations within their major. It's
proactive communication. Happy birthday cards. It's based on whether
you're about ready to become a junior; you haven't selected your
major. You need to file for graduation. That's where we start mining,
to find out the individual needs and interests and then pushing
that information back and creating enhanced communities.
Slide: Generation 4: High Touch/High Tech
UT Austin — Decision Making Guide
DARLENE: Well, let's take
a look at our first example of generation four. And I'm going to
go back to UT Austin again. They've done an excellent job with the
electronic services that they've created. And the example I've pulled
out is a job search. But it really is a good example of a decision
support tool, in that they focus on the job interest, the salary,
the date, the time, and that helps narrow or put on filters for
all the data that's out there. There's a wealth of data out on the
website, and you really need to help the student narrow it to what
applies to them. This might be applied to housing searches, parking
searches, class schedule searches, major searches.
PAT: I would love to see a
guide out there for helping students find their major. I have a
couple of daughters who could make good use of that. So if anybody
in our chat box has some suggestions for a good Web resource in
that regard I'd be very interested in it.
DARLENE: Does anyone have
a decision-support tool out there now for students? And if so, on
what topic? I'd like to see that appear in the chat box.
Slide: Generation 4: High Touch/High Tech
BYU — Decision Making Guide
DARLENE: Let's look at our
next example while some of those are coming in. Brigham Young University
has an example and, Pat, this goes along with what you were talking
about — helping your daughters choose a major.
PAT: Yes.
DARLENE: They've created a
worksheet for freshman. And on that worksheet for freshman, it has
a step-by-step guide — so you can see there's five steps that
it's going to guide them through — but they also have all
of the resources and all of the contacts that they would need to
help them build and define their first semester. So it's an excellent
way of helping create that decision tool, providing a very positive
experience, and also starting to form that relationship. You're
going well beyond just the transaction of the information.
PAT: Very interesting.
Slide: University of Delaware — Prospective
Students
DARLENE: Okay, let's look
at another guide in the University of Delaware prospective students.
I've pulled this off of the prospective students and I'm just showing
one page. But you can start to see that they have a step-by-step
guide. I go from prospective students to prospective undergraduate
students. And if I chose the undergraduate it would continue offering
me choices, and then would continue funneling me down the line,
helping me move from point to point until I got all of the information
I needed. So that would be a step-by-step guide.
Slide: Generation 4: High Touch/High Tech
— U of Minnesota Student Admissions Workbench Enhanced Community
DARLENE: Now, the next example
is University of Minnesota. And I wanted to switch gears here just
a bit. We've been talking about students and improving services
for students and creating the student-centric view. But what's important,
and what we discovered in looking at the physical centers, is —
and most of the institutions discovered very early on — is
when you're focusing on improving services for students, you also
have to provide equal attention and focus on improving the ability
of staff to deliver those services. So, with electronic student
services, how are you going to train and support the staff to answer
email or phone? How are you going to provide that general range
of knowledge? How are you going to create cross-functional teams
to help define and build those services? In this example, this is
the student admissions workbench. You can choose cohorts, you can
build in reports. You can see down on the bottom you can choose
the kind of reporting mechanism you want. But it becomes a workbench
to help you better work with a student in that area. So that becomes
a very, very important area.
PAT: I think that's absolutely
critical, Darlene. Many campuses start with redesigning their student
services from the students’ point of view, and that certainly should
be the driving force. But I think we have to balance that with providing
the staff with the right tools to respond to students. I mean, you
can design incredibly wonderful student services, but if you don't
give staff the tools they need to provide those services —
it just won't happen.
DARLENE: Well, and that's
another one of those very important critical success factors. You
know, you can have all of the best-laid plans, but if you haven't
helped the people who are going to support and implement it equally,
you're going to have a very tough time of sustaining it and also
being successful.
Slide: University of North Carolina Online
Personal Assistants
DARLENE: Well, let me show
you another example of high relationship, high experience. This
is the University of North Carolina at Greensboro. And on the left
you can see that they have a “UNCG Online” button. And when you
punch that button, you'll get a chat box. And that chat box will
bring up a generalist and that generalist will — live, as
we are now — respond to the student's questions. But when
you have someone out on the Web, they may or may not have access
to the phone, but they do have access to the Web, so how are you
going to start staffing and then presenting that information for
them to create that live added-value service chat?
PAT: And is that staffed by
staff, volunteers or students?
DARLENE: It's staffed by a
generalist. And one of the things that they do is the generalists
have decided to build an FAQ log, so that as they get questions
from the students, they're entering that information so that anyone
who responds will provide the same answer and consistency. And that
becomes, then, a valuable tool for the staff.
Slide: UC Gateways
DARLENE: Well, let's look
at the next example which is UC Gateway. This is the University
of California Gateways project. This focuses on the under-served
student and it's a portfolio. And in the portfolio, they have the
ability to contact their success team. So they’ve built a relationship
with three staff members. They have their phone number, their email,
and they have their test scores, their backpack. They're helping
this group of students prepare to go to college. These are first-time
college or, first-time students. They're eighth to twelfth grade.
No family member has gone to college. So they really need help.
So this is a outstanding example of how you would start to form
relationship and how you would really create that positive experience
that would help with retention, would help with recruiting, would
help with yield, would help with any number of things for a cohort
you wanted to target.
PAT: Darlene, is this gateway
project, is this the one associated with Francisco Hernandez?
DARLENE: It is. It's the University
of California at Santa Cruz is the prototype model.
PAT: Oh, that's great. He's
going to be our luncheon speaker at the annual conference in Coeur
d'Alene on November 2nd. We'll have to ask him about it.
DARLENE: You will. He'll have
some really nice stories for you about that.
Slide: The Evolution of Web Services Covers
Four Distinct Generations
DARLENE: Well, let's quickly
review the four areas of evolution of Web services. The first generation
focuses on content, so that's your physical silos, institutional
perspective, institutional vocabulary. It's usually the starting
point, but you want to try to move off of that fairly quickly. Generation
two focuses on who — perspective students; then what. It still
is institutional views, still perspective, but you can start to
get the action words in there. Generation three, you're at a true
portal. Personalized, customized community. It's focused on transactions.
And then generation four is where you start adding relationship
and experience and high touch, and that focuses on how and it's
guided and data mining — it's all of those elements that you
start to provide.
Question: What generation best describes
your current Web services?
DARLENE: I'd like to ask a
question here and I'd like to ask the individuals to respond which
generation they think best describes their current electronic student
services, and I'd like them to pick one of the four generations.
PAT: I think there's also
an "other" option, because there might be schools that
are hybrids.
DARLENE: Okay.
PAT: When your not completely
in one of the four generations.
DARLENE: And after you've
done that — after you've selected one, two, three, four, other
— I'd like for you to go to the chat box and in the chat box
I'd like for you to let me know if there's other institutions that
you would recommend that you believe have excellent models and should
be recognized as best practices in electronic services.
While we're collecting that information, I'd like to focus on an
area of consumer Web portals, and let me talk just a bit about that
while we still have this on the screen. This is, again, the lessons
learned. I like to focus on the lessons learned so we don't reinvent
the wheel and we share the information learned. In the commercial
websites, from Digital Magazine, they did a study and one of the
problems with the Web services, they all have on their Web —
here's an email that if you have a question email, if you want something,
email. Well, 56% of those websites didn't answer the email within
forty-eight hours. And 54% didn't answer the email at all. So when
you're trying to focus on customer satisfaction, student satisfaction,
student success, if you have an email and you're asking the student
to communicate in that manner, it becomes very important that you
have a process and you have criteria and you have measurements to
know how you're doing in that area because it will become a dis-satisfier.
Question Results: What generation best
describes your current Web services?
PAT: Okay, Sue, do you have
some results? Oh, here we go.
DARLENE: Okay, so 56% are
in Generation two. That's great. And 9% in Generation three Web
portal. And it looks like about 7% have some fourth generation services,
which are excellent. I'd love to find out what you have in there.
I'll have an email up later and anybody who wants to email me that,
that'd be super. I'd love to collect that information. And let's
see, it looks like, also, that they're suggesting to check out the
University of Michigan, at MSU. UCLA has a great portal, “My UCLA.”
Columbia Teachers University threaded discussions. Oh, Central Piedmont
Community College. I wonder what they have? That sounds great. Online
development at Houston Community College. Wow. Okay, I'd love to
hear more about those and find out what you're doing, because I'm
always looking for new examples and new models. And as well as I'm
sure Pat is.
PAT: Absolutely.
DARLENE: Pat, do you have
any comments here?
PAT: No. I'm delighted to
see these and I hope people will continue to add some as we move
along here.
Slide: Disney.com
DARLENE: Okay, well, let's
take a look now at some consumer sites. And there's four consumer
sites I'd like to discuss. Amazon.com, iQVC, eBay and Disney. Disney
is customer satisfaction, eBay customer-friendly, QVC overall and
Amazon overall. I won't show examples of Amazon.com overall, but
just a brief Disney. When you go to the Disney site, does this equate
to their brand or what? I mean, it's perfect. This is the experience
of Disney replicated on the website. It's not about transaction,
it's about experience.
Slide: QVC home page
DARLENE: Okay. Let's move
to the QVC website and I wanted to show you there the live chat.
And we're doing a bit of that today so I won't spend a lot of time,
but you could chat with the advisor, the chat with the financial
aide, chat with the majors, chat with different groups, to make
it more personal with the electronic student services.
Slide: Lands End – My Personal Shopper
DARLENE: One of my personal
favorites is Land's End. And Land's End, the first screen that I
want to show you, they provide a choice, up front, of how you choose
to interact with them. Well, let's see, it looks like we're on Personal
Shopper on 43. Okay?
PAT: And say you want to go
shop with a friend?
DARLENE: Let's do 42 for just
a second.
PAT: Okay.
DARLENE: Okay. On this one,
this is where we're choosing whether we phone or chat. So, you need
to consider how you're going to communicate with your students,
how you're going to interact with them live while they're doing
electronic student services. And then the next one, My Personal
Shopper, I want you to think about how you might create My Personal
Advisor or My Personal Schedule,” how do you use that data mining
and AI to present information? In this example, on slide 43, they're
taking My Personal Shopper — I answer a series of questions
about my preferences in clothing, style, color, size, and then they
present back to me those clothing items that would fit the description,
and then I can choose from those. And I think that's just a dynamite
way where we start using decision guides and some of this data mining
to start — not just presenting them information, but helping
them direct the information.
On the next slide, 44, Shop with a Friend, I wanted to present
this just to have you think about what you might do, how might you
use this? You might use this with Enroll with a Friend, Find Housing
with a Friend, Commute with a Friend, Study with a Friend online.
How might you allow more than one person to go through a process
at the same time? Now, one of the things I'd like to find out at
this point is what other commercial websites do you think have excellent
examples that people should be considering when they're building
models for their electronic student services?
PAT: Christina had already
beat you to the punch, Darlene.
DARLENE: Oh.
PAT: She talked about Nike.
DARLENE: Excellent.
DARLENE: Are there any others
that are out there for commercial sites that we should be considering?
Slide: IBM Best Practice Partners
DARLENE: Okay. Well, this
is a list of the institutions that have been identified as best
practice models. There's twenty-three of them. And we host a conference
once a year — it was last August at Tufts University. We'll
hold one again next August. And we'll also continue to add institutions
to this list as we focus on best practice models and student services.
PAT: Okay, we've got some
more answers, besides Nike. Toys'R'Us, Drugstore.com, Eddie Bauer...
DARLENE: Oh, good. I'll have
to go look at those. That's always exciting to find new models and
then pick out parts that we might apply to the student services
electronic student services. Okay. Well, they're putting up on the
screen my contact information, so if any of you have questions,
feel free to email me or to phone me, whatever is most convenient.
It looks like my email's up there.
Slide: Questions
PAT: And, Darlene, I think
you have a book coming out that has chapters in it by a number of
the best practice partners. Do you want to tell us a little bit
about that?
DARLENE: Yes, it's a case
studies book. Each of the best practice institution and partner
members will be discussing their lessons learned, their critical
success factors and their models. And that should be out in February
of 2002. It'll be published by SCUP. And SCUP is a Society for College
and University Planning, and I have their website listed here also.
PAT: Okay. That's great. Well,
on behalf of WCET, and all of our attendees, thank you, Darlene
for an excellent presentation. I think there've been some exciting
new trends that you've pointed out to us today and it looks like
we have lots of work ahead in order to get to this new relationship
environment, both face-to-face and electronic, if you're telling
us that is the direction to go.
DARLENE: Well, it's exciting
times and we finally have the technology that will support this
happening, so I'm really looking forward to hearing about and seeing
the new models that the institutions are starting to provide.
Slide: This series is brought to you as part
of WCET’s work on its Learning Anytime Anywhere Partnership Project
PAT: Okay. Well, I'd like
everyone to know a little bit more about this webcast series. It's
been brought to you as part of WCET's work on its learning anytime,
anywhere partnership project called Beyond the Administrative Core,
Creating Web-based Student Services for Online Learners. This project
is funded by the US Department of Education. Our special thanks
go to our corporate partner, HorizonLive, and especially Brendan
Kehoe and Matt Wasowski for making it possible to bring you these
presentations electronically.
Slide: Providing Student Services to Distance
Learners Webcast series
PAT: And if you'll go to our
website for additional information, you will see the links to this
webcast series. The URL is on the screen. And there, you'll be able
to register. And since this was recorded, you can access the archives.
Our next webcast will be November 14th at noon, Mountain Time. Mike
Leonard from Penn State University and the Chair of the Technology
and Advising Commission for the National Academic Advising Association...
DARLENE: Sue, do you have
any additional comments? I know we're going to plan to stay on about
another half hour if anyone wants to ask additional questions.
SUE: Yes, well, I was thinking
as I was watching the comments in the chat box, a lot of people
asked for the URLs of the sites that you discussed today, Darlene,
and, in fact, we should go ahead and add those to our WCET website.
So, even though the pictures are kind of small, it's because, you
know, the window is only so big - it's hard to see those sites and
really explore them. So hopefully, Darlene, you and I can figure
out the URLs and I'll include them.
DARLENE: We will.
SUE: People can check them
out.
DARLENE: In some cases, we'll
have to give you the contacts for the institution because you'll
need to get a guest ID. So once you get into the Web portal, you'll
need a guest ID to go in. And that's something, when you're developing
your electronic student services, I suggest you plan and create
a guest ID — that really is very helpful.
Slide: Thank you for Joining Us
SUE: Okay. Well, now is the
time for the evaluation.
Question: Evaluation
Survey
SUE: It's very important to
us at WCET and HorizonLive to know what you think. We're always
trying to improve. So if you could take a couple of minutes now
to fill out the text boxes there on the evaluation form, we'd really
appreciate it. And Darlene, thank you for your kind offer to stay
online for a while and continue chatting with people in the text
box. I'll remind everybody that this presentation has been recorded
and it's going to be archived and available on our website. But
it's real nice though, to stay online and be able to chat with the
expert. So, thanks, Darlene.
DARLENE: You're welcome. I'm
looking for questions.
SUE: Okay. While we're doing
that we still have quite a few folks online. Are any of you in the
process of redesigning your services that you have that you're providing
electronically? Are you going through a redesign process? I'd be
interested in which institutions are actually going through a redesign
process. The slides are all available on the archive, as is the
voice, as are the comments. So you should have a complete replay
on the archives. In a couple of minutes, after I hope people have
finished the evaluation form, I'm going to put in that large window
the conference sites for the WCET conference. So people who are
interested can check that out.
DARLENE: Well, we're getting
really nice comments from everybody. Thank you very much.
DARLENE: So, Weber State is
redesigning online support services. That's excellent. I'd love
to hear from you about what you're doing.
SUE: SorenG wonders whether
the archives are going to be on HorizonLive or WCET or what? The
answer is: it will be at the WCET website. It's http://www.wiche.edu/wcet.
And you'll need to move from there to projects, and then to “Beyond
the Administrative Core.”
DARLENE: I have a question.
It's BSU. Liz Ackerman. You say you're working on the redesign.
What services are you redesigning? All of the services? Enrolment
services or related services?
Slide: erevolution@edu
DARLENE: Bob, what is it you'd
like to know if it's going to be answered? I'm not sure what your
question is. I'll look back and see if I can find it.
PAT: There's a question on
archives on HorizonLive or WCET. You can. you can access them from
the WCET website. They're actually held at HorizonLive.
DARLENE: Susan Smith, what
institution are you with? And Wayne needs the URL. Perhaps you could
type the URL in, Suse.
DARLENE: Okay. It just hasn't
scrolled onto my screen yet. There it is.
PAT: And from that URL, people
can check out the conference in Coeur d'Alene, they can check out
our particular Beyond the Administrative Core project. There's lots
of information and tools on our website, and hope people start thinking
of it as a go-to site for all kinds of information.
PAT: And I think many people
should be seeing the program, right now for the annual conference
up on their screen.
SUE: Right.
PAT: And it's actually a live
link, so you can kind of browse through there and look for some
presentations on student services if you go to the Services Track,
you'll see what the presentations are going to be all about.
DARLENE: And Catherine to
Northern Arizona, you're just designing your services and, again,
are those enrolment services, or enrolment plus related services?
And I guess, one of the questions I would also have, are you designing
for distance education students only or are you designing students
or, the electronic student services for all students? Thanks, Kenneth
W., on that information North Carolina. I'll do that. I'll contact
Dr. Cannoy and the "@" isn't there.
PAT: I think one of the one
thing we found in a project in the in the lab project that we're
doing right now, that it's difficult to design Web-based student
services for the distance learner only because, on a number of campuses,
the online learners are in the dorms. And so it takes on a different
character and you need to look at designing services that will really
serve both students, the traditional students in the dorm who are
studying online, and those students who can never come to campus.
I wonder if other folks in our audience have had a similar experience?
DARLENE: There is a website
that KennethW just mentioned: the CFNC.org, and I would encourage
everyone to go out and take a look at that website. It is dynamite.
It's the State of North Carolina and they've just done an excellent,
excellent job with that.
PAT: And I see Susan Smith
from Weaver State said that their focus is on designing electronic
services for all students. Not sure where Catherine Helig is from.
They are mostly focusing on distance education students. And I think,
sometimes, what happens in that case is that to sort of lead the
way for the campus to expand in delivering services electronically
for other students by demonstrating the success of doing it for
distance students.
DARLENE: Are there any other
questions that the folks that are still here would like to ask specific
to what you're trying to accomplish on your campus, or the says
that you're in within your campus, have you run into any problems?
One of the things that we didn't discuss was not project management,
but also dealing with some of the human issues of change management.
Okay, so we're starting with students taking courses online, but
on-campus students take Pat, you were mentioning something about
the number of on-campus students taking distance education courses.
I thought that was pretty remarkable.
PAT: Yes. One of the institutions
we're working with in this project now, that initially they thought
they were going to design student services for their distance students.
But when they looked at the enrolment, they found that 80% of their
distance students, their online learners, were living on campus.
So I think, increasingly, campuses are finding that.
DARLENE: Well you know, I
think that's pretty remarkable. I would not have ever guessed that.
But it's the same thing that they found with creating the physical
one-stop centers. I think the initial assumption was that the students
who were on campus, living in dormitories, would prefer to deal
with someone face-to-face. But then, what they have found is that
70% of those students would rather be in the dorm, in the library,
at home, in a self-service environment doing their services.
Slide: Thank you for joining us
PAT: Very interesting. Are
there any other questions for Darlene? Well, thank you very much
for joining us and we look forward to seeing you on November 14th
when we focus on academic advising.
DARLENE: Any ideas on e-distribution
of homework and exams? Well, I've been more on the services side,
Pat. Do you have anything on the eDistribution of homework and exams?
PAT: No. I'm afraid I don't.
But maybe someone in the audience does.
DARLENE: Well, Catherine,
if you're looking for state-wide services, take a look at that North
Carolina website that I'm going back to get that. That was CFNC.org.
It's for financials and it's state-wide and it's just excellent.
So that would be a good example of state-wide. And the other example
of good state-wide would be the University of Texas application
for admission. And that's hosted by UT Austin. But that gets into
the transcripts, and some of the things. I know you're already doing
that in Arizona. And I'm not sure where the differences are on that.
We haven't talked about courseware yet, such as Blackboard. Do you
have any comments on the courseware, Pat?
PAT: No, I was still thinking
a little bit about the question about the state-wide efforts. There
are certainly efforts underway in a number of states to create state-wide
services and we had a number of people here from Alaska earlier
and I know they're working on that. They might want to comment about
what they're doing. Also there are some efforts there. And perhaps
Gary Kleemann or others from Arizona can tell a little bit about
what they're doing. There've been some regional efforts, as well.
Been some efforts like in Ohio for providing library services at
the state level. So there are a number of initiatives out there
for providing services at the state-wide level. Many of those are
still in the beginning stages. One you might want to look at is
Kentucky Virtual University. They have some efforts and I don't
know if Pam McBrayne is still on, but she might want to comment
on that.
I can tell you a little bit about a project that we have underway
that — while we're looking for questions here, and it a new
project, it's going to be funded by the Tulip Foundation, and one
of the aspects of it is to evaluate products and services that support
student services, and it will be a Web-based tool that will help
institutions compare different products that are out there to support
student services, or if the institution would prefer to outsource
a particular student service, to look at and compare different services
by different service providers. So that was just started in the
development and that'll probably be a year before we have that up
and running. But it's something to keep in mind. I wonder if Dan
would like to comment. Dan Volchok from WebCT talked about offering
tutoring and office hours and orientation through various courseware
packages that Dan might want to say a little bit more about what
he's thinking about there.
One of the other Hewlett projects is one which will compare the
various features of the different courseware management systems
that are out on the market. So that's another site to keep in mind.
Certainly, when we began our last project, Darlene, we didn't realize
how important the SIS system, the Student Information System was,
in designing the personalized services that students now expect.
And all of the problems you can run into in terms of authentication
and security, with multiple systems. Because, in our case, we were
initially focused on just the distance students, and a number of
institutions have distance students registered in entirely separate
databases.
DARLENE: Yes.
PAT: The records are separate.
And so it really makes for a fairly complex problem initially.
DARLENE: Well, you know, that's
one of the areas we didn't get into and discuss today. But when
you're thinking about selecting new student administrating system,
there's always a question of the chicken or the egg. Do you redesign
services first or do you select a student administration system
first, and then redesign? But I think you have to do at least part
of the redesign first in terms of understanding what services you
want to be able to provide the students and how you want them to
be able to interact. Not a complete redesign of processes, but at
least the beginning. Because you need that information when you
start to select your student administrative system.
And you need to be realistic, because there aren't that many systems
out there, and you need to find out the functionality that they
have. But that will help you in the selection because it's kind
of like taking the physical model and implementing it on the Web
and we still have the students do the run-around on the Web and
we still have the internal view and silos. We do that same thing
when we implement a student administrative system. If we haven't
started the thought process and even some of the action on redesign,
we'll end up implementing the student system with the old traditional
model. And then we'll try to go back and make changes after the
fact.
So those institutions that have you know, the opportunity to choose
the sequence, there should be some portion of redesign so that they
understand what they want to be able to do, then assess the administrative
systems to see what functions are available, so that whey they implement
that system they'll at least implement it with an eye to the new
redesign.
PAT: Good point.
SUE: Right. And this is when
the return on investment becomes so important, because you're talking
about significant expenditures.
PAT: Well, you are redesigning
the student information system.
DARLENE: And if you're going
to spend that kind of money on a new student information system,
you really want to be able to deliver more than just the traditional
transactions. And you want to be able to do more than just the way
you have already been conducting business. So it's really important
to think of those other elements, of how you're going to change
and what you need to add. And then, if those systems will all support
it. And then how you would implement those as you begin that new
system.
SUE: Yeah... well, looks like
our chat box has slowed down. Now would be the time if anybody else
has comments to make or questions to pose to Pat or Darlene.
DARLENE: I'll add my email,
so if anyone wants to email me anything, they'll have that in the
chat box.
PAT: Sounds good. And I think
it looks like there are a number of people with an interest in the
topic of orientation, so we may have that as a topic in the spring,
so be on the lookout for that.
SUE: And I noticed one comment,
and probably about the middle of the presentation, someone requested
specifically hearing more about online advising. I was, like, oh,
yes. We just happen to have that subject next in our webcast series.
DARLENE: What's the date of
your next webcast?
PAT: The next webcast is November
14th.
SUE: It will also be at noon,
Mountain Time.
PAT: We'll have Mike Leonard
here.
DARLENE: Well, it looks like
there are no more questions.
PAT: Darlene, thank you again
for taking the time to do this today, and provide your expertise
and light conversation to answer everyone's questions.
DARLENE: Well, you're welcome.
It was very enjoyable. It's nice to experience the electronic exchange
of ideas and also how we're going to start delivering the education.
So it was a good experience. Thank you very much for including me.
PAT: And thank you, Sue, for
getting this all organized and participating today and keeping your
eye on the questions from the audience.
SUE: You're welcome. Thank
you, Pat.
PAT: We'll see you again on
the 14th of November. Thank you very much.
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